I am joined by Jen Gottlieb and Chris Winfield comes on to talk about to be the Super Connector, and the benefit of having the "Be on TV" skills!
Do you know someone that is like a super connector and just know everyone in the planet? Wouldn't it great to know more people other than your immediate social circle?
In this episode, Jen Gottlieb, Actress, and co-founder of Super Connector Media, and Chris Winfield, entrepreneur, writer, coach and co-founder of Super Connector Media, came on to talk about the techniques and the benefit becoming a Super Connector!
Jen also talked about the imposter syndrome that she had seen during her actress and hosting days, and how to overcome them. And Chris talked about how he made it to the top just by connecting with the right people, and networking!
They also talked about the boot camp that they're organizing that will help with the "TV" skills, networking skills and all! They were so kind that they even created a special link for the listener @ beontvbootcamp.com/altucher and they're going to be something special waiting for the listener!
Listen to the episode, and make sure you visit beontvbootcamp.com/altucher so you can get a special treat from Jen and Chris!
My new book Skip The Line is out! Make sure you get a copy wherever you get your new book!
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I write about all my podcasts! Check out the full post and learn what I learned at jamesaltucher.com/podcast.
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James Altucher 0:01
This isn't your average business podcast, and he's not your average host. This is the James Altucher Show.
Chris Winfield 0:12
Today on the James
James Altucher 0:13
Altucher show, there are some people who I view as what I call super connectors. If I need to meet like, Hey, do you know anybody at XYZ company? Do you know anyone at Google, nobody at Forbes, whoever yet, I don't know, the government. These super connectors, always know somebody or know somebody who knows somebody, and they're really happy to connect people up. First, Winfield Jen Gottlieb, they are total super connectors. They teach how to be super connectors. And there's so much I learned from them about entrepreneurship and how I could be a better entrepreneur. So here they go, Chris Winfield and Jim Gottlieb.
Let's talk about you guys. Like, before I even knew the name of your company. I thought to myself, these two are super connectors. First off, I can't even remember how I met both you I met both of you before you were together. And now you're getting married. Congratulations. And I always knew, like Chris, you would organize dinners. And then both of us would organize these conferences, and I'd go to them. A everyone was happy. Like, they're all like, Oh, I'm so happy since I met Chris and Jen. And then also everybody was introducing each other. It was all interesting people, they all were doing interesting things. Everybody followed up afterwards, if you saw someone standing in the corner, usually me you would say Oh, you have to meet so and so you have to meet so and so. So you know there are there is a category of people. And I've only met a few people like this, who really are super connectors like they know everybody, and they also know how to meet everybody. So I used to work with a PR firm. I don't know if you know, I'm going to shout out a random person. But Julie hunt. She used to run PR for Financial Times and IBM now she has her own company. She's like a major super connector in my life. You guys were super connectors. But more importantly, right now you're you're being very focused on helping people it whether they're influencers or entrepreneurs, or you could describe other categories, but you're helping them get media, which is incredibly difficult. Like we're living in this attention saturated society. So if you want to stand out with a product or a book, or an idea, or you want to get you mentioned on TV or in the newspaper, it's impossible. And not only is it hard, but I know for my own self, I I've been on TV quite a bit. So I'm, I'm gonna let you guys talk in a second. I just, this is why I'm so excited to have you on I love this. Like, hey, I would say the fact that I've been on TV quite a bit, for better or for worse, has helped me incredibly in my career, because I'm a very shy, introverted person, but on TV, I'm not. And so it's helped me quite a bit like people know me. So that gives me opportunities. And second, it's very hard for me to ask to go on TV, or like when I have a book out, I know every podcaster out there. And some of them, many of them are good friends, it's hard for me to call them and say, Hey, I have a new book out. Could you put me on? I never do that. I can't ask people. I was even going to write a book called The Power of ask. And I'm so bad at it. I decided not to write the book. I had to return the advanced money. So. So yes, so you guys are great at all these things. So now fortunately for me, I I've been on a lot of media and TV and podcasts and books and everything. But you help people just starting out do this. And I have to say to anyone listening it's incredibly, incredibly important. And it's incredibly hard to do. You say you could do it within five days of meeting someone. What the hell are you talking about?
Chris Winfield 4:05
Jen you want to start?
Jen Gottlieb 4:06
Yeah, well, here's the thing, James, I want to just reframe the asking for help thing really quick for you.
James Altucher 4:13
Because this is a therapy session.
Jen Gottlieb 4:15
Yes, a little bit because I'm going to ask you, how do you feel when somebody that you care about asks you for help, and you're able to help them? Like how did you feel like when someone recently I'm sure someone asked you for helping someone that you love and you're like, Oh, you're I can help you? How does that make you feel?
James Altucher 4:31
Oh, it's amazing. I mean, it's I remember, back in 1996 1995, a friend of mine was unemployed. And I was and this is the first time I ever had like, I was in a situation with some power where I was able to help this friend of mine who was about to move out of New York because he was unemployed and losing all his money. And I was able to get him a job and get him a nice deal of nice salary and everything. And that was the first time I ever did it. And I thought oh my My gosh, this is like this magic feeling inside of me. Like I was able to help someone. And I was able to build a career after that around helping people.
Jen Gottlieb 5:09
It feels so good when you're able to help somebody that you care about. So yeah, whenever you're thinking about asking somebody, especially someone that you're close to, for help, just think about how amazing you're going to get to make them feel when they help you. And every time that you don't ask them for help, you're taking away that incredible feeling that you could be giving that person
James Altucher 5:28
I know, I know you say that. But I somehow when I see how you're reframing it, but I always when you when you ask up. I always feel like everyone's like, Oh my god, another person asking me for help. Because here's the thing, I get emails all day long, hey, you know, Mr. Alpha chair, can you XYZ, and then I don't really like it as much like when it's just, you know, generic, because I do a lot to help people anyway, just I give away almost all my stuff for free. Like my writing and podcasting. And so I don't sometimes, like when people ask me,
Chris Winfield 6:02
here's the thing, so because they have no relationship with you, there's no relationship capital or anything. So one of the things that we always teach people is that if you're gonna, like, if you're gonna ask somebody for something, or let's say you're pitching the media, or whatever, build some sort of relationship, figure out what you can do to help that person. And as you know, because you've met, and you're friends with, you know, some of the most richest, most successful, most famous people, not every single person, no matter who it is, needs help with something like there's not one person alive, the rock needs help with something, you know, there's like, it doesn't matter, like, and it's your job, like, you know, the whoever the other person is to figure out what it is, how can I be the one to help that person? And it changes as the higher you go up. But I think that's the big difference of like, somebody who's just cold pitching you and saying, like, Hey, can you help me with this? Or can you be my mentor? Because you wrote about mentoring in like, your books and like, so I'm sure you get so many people asking that. But they're, they haven't done anything for you, you know, they haven't put in that time to figure out how can I help Jane. So that's the difference. Like what Jen saying is, like, if it's somebody that you're helping, that you already have a relationship with, that you love that you care about, or you know, maybe even just like, and then you do something to help them like you feel great. So that's the way that we're always thinking about it. We're never thinking of it, like from a real like transactional standpoint, where it's like, alright, well, I, I'm going to ask this person, and every single person I'm going to ask is going to help me because No, that's not how the world works. Most people, as you know, like, you've written about, like, the power of rejection, you know, all these things, like, the most people are gonna say no, and that's okay.
James Altucher 7:44
You're 100%, right. Like, one time when I was this, like, in 2002, I was totally broke. I was really depressed and down and out. And I did just that I wrote to everybody saying, Hey, can I just get five minutes of your time buy a cup of coffee? Zero, people responded, like, and I've said this on the podcast before, it's not like Warren Buffett is gonna say, Hey, he's gonna say he's not gonna say to a secretary, Gladys drop everything. James Altucher wants me to buy a cup of coffee, or wants to buy me a cup of coffee. Like he doesn't care. So I went, I started writing this 10 ideas a day. And I started coming up with ideas for everyone. And then just giving them for free and not asking to get together saying, Hey, you could have these ideas for free. And then I got responses.
Chris Winfield 8:29
Yeah, exactly. And I, for me, when I was at my, one of my lowest points, when I'd lost everything, and I wanted to get, I wanted to start doing this thing where I'd meet with somebody every single day. So what I did was a little bit different. I just figured out who could refer me to the person. So who could introduce me to them? So and I made this like list and I'd say, alright, this person has these connections that I know how can I get them to insure me so as a result of that I met with like, the guy who won the New York Times, you know, the guy who owned
James Altucher 9:01
describe that story like so Salzburg, or Arthur's
Chris Winfield 9:06
Upper West Side guy, or was. So here's the interesting thing. I grew up in a household that my parents were both school psychologists. I was the first person in my in my family to not work in a school and to actually just like, get a job outside of school because I was a terrible student, I was got in trouble. So I didn't come from like an entrepreneurial or well connected family. But here's the thing I remembered that my father had volunteered at Mohonk, which is a place in New Paltz, you might know it, and Arthur happened to be on the board of Mohonk. So my father had a bit of a relationship with Him through that. So I, as I was doing my list, I remembered all these different things. I'm writing them all out. And boom, I father was able to connect me to Arthur and at a time
James Altucher 9:55
when I feel bad, did he feel bad about asking Arthur?
Chris Winfield 9:58
No, because we are good relationship, right. And, you know, I think it's also like when you're interviewing somebody or you know, asking on behalf of somebody else, it's even easier. Because it's not like about yourself so and like I just kept going through, and then I would get like a intro from that person. So for example, our third then connected me to the VP of Marketing for the times, and, you know, then the VP of Marketing connected me to the events person from the times. And you know, all I was doing was showing up trying to figure out what I could do to help the people because I had nothing to offer.
James Altucher 10:31
So before you met Arthur, or even as part of the ask, perhaps, was there something you were offering? Like, what what was the idea you had for Arthur that he couldn't get anywhere else?
Chris Winfield 10:42
Yeah, so the idea for him was just simply that it was more around like a thinking Grow Rich, in terms of like, when Napoleon Hill met with Carnegie and, you know, more around being able to extract like, some wisdom from Him. Like, really, and you know, and for whatever reason, at that point, he was he was open to that. And he came and like, he actually taught me a lesson about humility. So this was a guy like, you know, going to meet him in Time Square, like, it's literally I'm like, if this is your square name that the New York Times and he came out, I you know, and I just lost all my money in this business had completely imploded and he came, met me at the elevator did not even have like, a, you know, didn't even have like somebody else from a staff or anything, like met me at the elevator was so gracious with his time, walk me around to the different things like that, you know, that was one of those lessons for me about like, oh, wow, like you can be this successful and still be super humble. And, you know, and that, that that literally, like, changed my life, just that meeting, I don't remember exactly what we talked about. But I will never forget him coming out to meet me on the 13th floor and saying, Hey, I'm Arthur.
James Altucher 12:01
And did it lead to something like, yes, it led to
Chris Winfield 12:05
the connection with New York Times, and then doing some stuff with them. And then getting in with their event space. And you know, other things, and then just relationships, like even down the line. And, you know, what it also led to, was having a great story to talk about with, you know, about humility, and you know, that thing,
James Altucher 12:27
see, people underestimate the power of story, also, the worst case scenario and read in this, I need to tell myself, but the worst case scenario and reaching out to somebody in an interesting way, is that you have a story out of it.
Chris Winfield 12:39
100%, and even if it's, and a lot of times, as we all know, and like you're the you're the champion, and this is like, if it's a bad story, or if it's a story that when like if he came in, like he hated me, and like, you know, like, was so rude and all this, like, That's a great story, too. So like, like, I'm gonna win either way. So the only way I don't win is if I don't make the ask if I don't go and meet him. And I you know, and that's the thing. Like, we always feel that way. I remember when Jen and I were at your club, does that stand up? And why? And we were talking in Seinfeld after, after he had, it was like a memorial day or something. And I was asking him some questions. And I was like, do you still keep in touch with Larry David? And he's like, Yeah, and I was like, How do you feel like when you're done talking to me, he's like, You know what, I always feel horrible when I'm calling him. But I always feel amazing when I get off the phone. And I was like, that's it for everything. Because any event like you were talking about the events that we do, or, you know, our challenges or anything, like, whenever I'm like, gonna have to go somewhere. Like, even as my own event, I'm like, Oh my God, how can I get out of this? Like, can they like is it is the place gonna just like, you know, like, catch on fire or something? And like, but then like, when you leave, you almost always feel better. So I don't know. I just went off on a big tangent, but
James Altucher 13:57
then No, that's totally true. Also, so nobody likes to go to anything. Particularly now we're all you we built the habit of just staying home by tag. So what are you telling people who you meet like, Who's Who's the type of person you can get on TV? Can anyone and I use get on TV, but it's really about like all media, like any media presence, but you you I know, you're focusing on TV, because that's maybe the hardest get?
Chris Winfield 14:21
Yeah, it's maybe the hardest and also the the most cachet. You know, in terms of like, when my parents see me on TV, they're like, Wow, you're doing so great. You're so successful, you know, they might not know anything about what I'm doing, you know, in my life, but they see me on TV or their friends even TV and they're like, Wow, that's and I think that's what happens in the minds of our customers in the minds of our audience. Genuine to talk a little bit about like what we actually do.
Jen Gottlieb 14:48
Yeah, so anybody really that has a service a story or a product that wants to get it out into the masses or anybody that wants to be considered as the recognized expert because something really magical happens. I mean, just think about it this way, when you see someone on TV, all of a sudden your perception of that person changes. Like you could see, even with even with big publications like AI, a great example is the other day I did an Instagram live about how to connect with people in real life better, okay, I was like, I'm gonna do this Instagram Live, it's gonna be awesome. I'm going to get all this engagement, I have this great idea. So I do this Instagram Live, it does, okay, doesn't get that much engagement. It's not that fabulous. But I believed in the idea. And I was like, people need to know how to connect in real life. They need to know how to go to events, they need these tips. I'm going to take this and I'm going to pitch it to Forbes, and I'm going to see what happens if it becomes a Forbes article. And through relationships, somebody that I also that I've been building a relationship with and providing value to for a really long time. I've never asked her for anything before in my life, I decided to make the ask because I was ready because I've been giving and giving and giving. And she was so excited to help me. So this Instagram Live, same content turned into a Forbes article this you can use for TV as well,
James Altucher 15:56
that is so important. This is this is what I call the spoken wheel technique. You have like a core idea. And it doesn't matter whether you first present it in a blog post, like a LinkedIn article, a podcast and Instagram Live, it can be a book or on TV, it could go on all of them ultimately, like you always just repackage repurpose. And this becomes, you know, the wheel has many spokes. So and also when you're when you went to the forest person, it's not like hey, can I start writing for you? I do this this? No, it's like you gave him you solve the problem for them. They need content all day long every day, and you gave them hey, I could turn this around right away for you guys.
Jen Gottlieb 16:34
Yep. And she and she was ready for me because I had always been just keeping the relationship going. This was a relationship that I'd had for a couple of years, James where I'd never asked her for a thing. And then I was ready. I was like, okay, and she was like, Sure, yes, please, can I help you? Yes, let's do it. It's a great idea. So here's what happened when this little Instagram Live that did nothing. Turn into a mainstream media piece with the name Forbes on top. Now we're talking about TV choose, you could think of the same thing as like a CNN segment, right? All of a sudden, everybody came out of the woodwork. Oh, my God, you're in Forbes, congratulations. I got like, I hundreds of shares from this Forbes article, people talking about it. Then the next week, I got to speak at this mastermind that I'm in the 100 million mastermind with Dan Fleischman. And Joel Marion. And I spoke on stage and I put the Forbes article on the screen. And after my speech, everyone was going crazy. Congrats on Forbes. That's amazing. They were all sharing it. So when you get into mainstream media, it could be the exact same content that you've already talked about. But the perception is different. And suddenly, I looked different in people's eyes. Suddenly, I just was like, more famous, more important. And that's just how mainstream media gives you that credibility and makes people like, want to talk to you and want to be near you
James Altucher 17:49
for for better or for worse, like, Who knows if that's a valid reason for people to want to talk to you. But it is it that is the truth. And the other thing is, Forbes gets a lot of eyeballs to if I'm using the correct technical term. And, you know, that's why people love to spend millions of dollars advertising in Forbes. So if you can get free placing in a place that other people spend millions of dollars advertising, that's worth real money to someone's business to someone's, you know, career and so on. I you know, there was one time. So I back in the o's and I actually all throughout, I've been on CNBC and other networks up quite a bit, you know, commenting on financial stuff, mostly. But there was one time I wasn't on for six months, and I was afraid, oh my gosh, people are gonna forget about me, like six months is like a lifetime. But then, you know, it doesn't even matter if it's been years like people still remember people still know you're that guy and blah, blah, blah. So it lasts for a long time, that credibility. Exactly. And
Chris Winfield 18:55
the cool thing is, as well is that and one of the things that we teach people is the power of leverage. So I have stuff that is from, you know, that I still tell stories about from like, 2002 When I was on SFX, or 2003. Like, you just frame it around, like a story that you want to tell. So it doesn't matter. Like a lot of times people are like how I can never talk about that that happened a month ago, and like a month, I'm talking about things from 18 years ago, like still like it because as long as you're going back to like the power of story, and the power of being able to tap into your audience and you know, be able to make them relate to you more. It's so powerful. And, you know, the way that I found out about all like get about media is that when I had one job in my life, and it was horrible, it was absolutely horrible. And I when I they stopped paying me and you know, I had no money and so I decided to start my own company. And I wasn't doing great. It was a web design and search engine optimization company and that was 2002
James Altucher 20:00
and absolute worst year for both of those categories. Yes, exactly.
Chris Winfield 20:04
So, so I was doing art and there's like an as you know, there was like a million other people trying to do the same thing and all that. So I was I was watching CNBC one day, and I'm like, wow, like some guy was on. I'm like, I want to be that guy. I want to hire that guy. Like, I want to know that guy. And I'm like, we just because he's on TV. So I had that realization, you know, the trust the authority, all that. And I'm like, what if I could do that for myself, and I beside no money, I had no connections at that point. And there were so many other people that were doing the exact same thing. So I started figuring out how to get in the media I got on in the New York Times, it was actually about remote working, which is so weird. Like it was like a 2002 or 2000, I think 2002 article about remote working and like how it was just starting to come out. And then, and then like, the next year, I got in an article in USA Today. And this was when USA Today was on every hotel, you know, doorstep and everything. And literally within six hours, I got a division of virgin, virgin. They signed on they Well, they found me and then they wind up signing on as a client, they became my first multimillion dollar client. And I was just hooked. I was like, wow, this is the and throughout my career, whatever business it was, that was always the common denominator. For me, I always use media as like my unfair advantage to separate myself to differentiate myself. And then that's what we teach people to do the same thing like how anyone can do it. Because listen, I'm as basic as they come like, I have no degree. I mean, I think I have a bachelor's, but I have no like letters before, after my name, I have, you know, no special skills or anything. And like, I was always able to do it. And that's like, the thing that we tell people like, it doesn't, you know, if you have a story, if you're, you don't need to have to necessarily hire a fancy PR firm, we have a PR agency, and I still tell people that you know, you can you can do it yourself.
James Altucher 21:59
So, I mean, in this story, as you described, you had some connections to the times, you know, Jen, you had some connections to forums that you've been working on for years, let's just let's go through like an example. Let's say I approached you. And I started a company and I made, I don't know, software that helps nail salons keep track of their customers or whatever. And I'm, you know, every now I'm already sell it. Every nail salon needs software for you know, CRM software for their customers, and blah, blah, blah. And now I want to get some media. So it's kind of like a weird little business. And I don't have any connections other than nail salon people are in software people, what would you tell me? How would you help me?
Chris Winfield 22:43
Let's break it down. Jen.
Jen Gottlieb 22:44
Yes. Okay. So the first thing you're gonna want, there's two steps here. And the first step you want to do is you want to get super, super clear on where you want to be in the media. And you may be like, Jen, I don't even know this is like a software for nail salons, like, where are they going to talk about me? What? I don't know. Yeah, like, where, but you don't even realize, James, there's so many more opportunities than you even know, there are so many niche publications that we don't even know necessarily right now off the top of our heads exists, and so many different, like smaller television networks, and even now with the internet, places and media that you could be. So the best way that we tell people to figure out where you want to be, is to use FOMO. And I don't mean FOMO like fear of missing out, like when your friends are at a party and you're like, oh my god, I'm following. I mean that that feeling that you have when you see somebody else that maybe is your competitor, or does something similar to you and you you see them in the media, or you see them getting a lot of attention, and you feel like oh my god, that should be me. Why is that? Not me?
James Altucher 23:43
Well, that is really important. Because let's say someone's deciding on which which company to use if one company has been on TV and the other hasn't. If that's it, that's the decision.
Jen Gottlieb 23:54
Yeah. So look, Google them go, it's so simple. Go into Google News and Google your competitor and see where in the media they're showing up, you're probably going to find especially if it's like a software or something like that different niche publications that you didn't even know existed, that they've been featured it. And you're just going to use their beautiful yellow brick road that they painted for you on what journalists are writing about what you talk about what shows are featuring the topic that you talked about, so you're going to use that FOMO that jealousy that you feel like we all do it, we all compare ourselves to other people or to our competitors. So you're going to create a list using that FOMO following other people that do the same thing as you that once you have the list, this is the key so be like alright, yeah, now I have this list. Now what do I do? Okay, cool.
James Altucher 24:38
Hold on one second. Let me yeah, I'm gonna just Google software for nail salons
Jen Gottlieb 24:45
and Google News. Yeah,
Chris Winfield 24:48
I'll do that. And then here's the other side. While you're doing that, it also the other part is like that. You can also be in mainstream publication. So because you have story.
James Altucher 25:00
So the New York Times The New York Times, a few months ago, want your nails done, let a robot do it. And then there's a lot Oh TechCrunch Newsweek. So okay, all right. Yeah, exactly. News, CNBC. Yeah. All right, go ahead. So that's so cool
Chris Winfield 25:18
side. So that
Jen Gottlieb 25:20
shows you it's possible. Okay, so now we know it's possible. And now we know there are journalists writing about it. And there are producers that are producing segments about it amazing. So that kind of debunks our limiting belief that like, Who would want to know about this?
Chris Winfield 25:31
Yeah, the cool thing is also just to jump in is like, you look at each one of those people, either the, whoever the writer was, or whoever the like if it says the producer for like, let's say, the CNBC segment, like those, all those people are people that you can now pitch as well, because you have to just you're gonna have a different angle on their story. And you know, it's something they already are interested in. Alright, keep going.
Jen Gottlieb 25:56
Mm hmm. So, you got that. So you can cold pitch these people, all right, that's we all can do that we can all find an email, we can cold pitch them, but we bring on a lot of producers onto our programs of shows. And the number one question that people ask them is what's going to make you open up my pitch? What's gonna make you open up my email, and they all say the same thing. They're like, listen, I get 1000s of emails in my inbox pitches a week 1000s Yeah, so I'm probably not going to open your email, unless I know you or have a relationship with you or know someone that knows you or got an introduction. So we always say that relationships are the key when it comes to getting in the media. So James, we actually have like this tool that I really want to teach you right now. Because it's gonna rock your world, and you're going to be able to use it to get in the media, or just to get anything that you want in your life in 20 days using your network. Okay, did you
James Altucher 26:48
bring it on?
Jen Gottlieb 26:49
Okay, let's go. So this is called the top 20 tool. And what we don't realize often is you said to me, you're like, Jen, I don't know anybody, I don't have any connections. But you do, you have so many more connections than you even realize, and everybody listening to also does, they just either are a little too scared to really dig in and think about asking people for things or reaching out to people, okay, so they put it to the side, or B, they're just not looking hard enough or thinking deep enough. So we have this tool called the top 20. And it can work for any goal, whether that's to get into the media, get investors for your company, find customers find a girlfriend or a boyfriend or a husband or a wife, it works. Alright, so everyone that's listening, and James, you're going to make four columns on a sheet of paper, okay, long ways, columns in the first column all the way on the left, on the top, you're going to write people, okay? And you're going to do a list of 20 people that you know, in your whole life network, so not just your business network, your life, people, you went to high school, college with your answer uncles, your brothers, your sisters, your cousins, everybody that you know, anyone that could possibly help you with that goal. So for this case, to get you into the media, so maybe they have a connection to someone in the media, maybe they used to work at the media. Anyone open your phone, open your Facebook, your Instagram go deep. Your brain might be like, But Jen, like, I really feel like I don't I bet you you know more than you think especially Jane
James Altucher 28:28
and I can I add to this, you shouldn't you shouldn't filter that list, you shouldn't say, Oh, well, this person doesn't like me. So it's not a connection, or Oh, I didn't go to this person's birthday party. So I can't really call him now. Like he there should be no filter, because that's all narrative in your head, not in their head.
Jen Gottlieb 28:46
Yep, 1,000%, you just write their name down anyway, don't worry about talking to them. Yet. This part is not about talking to anybody. It's just you in your room writing some names down. So just no filter, it reminds
Chris Winfield 28:56
me of like so with your ideas list, you know, your 10 ideas a day. You like how you say, like, write the ideas down, even if you think they're horrible, and you're never going to use them because it's just the you're flexing your idea muscle. So here, you're flexing your connection muscle. And yeah, you know, in that way, so
James Altucher 29:14
and most people just like most ideas don't work out. Most people won't respond to you, but you only need that first one. So like, even when I had all the ideas, and I was writing to people to give them ideas, you know, three out of 20 Respond to that first, that first time, you know, and then a response rate gets better and better. But initially, you just needed to use need a few responses, and most won't respond. You just
Jen Gottlieb 29:39
yeah, you just need one. And when you write down all those names, it really reminds you Oh, wait, I knew more people than I thought I did. So maybe I'm holding myself back in other ways, too. So it's a great exercise. Justin, Chris, I love that you said that about the 10 ideas. Because when I started doing that, I was like, I have so many more ideas than I realized Yeah, 10 ideas
James Altucher 29:58
a day thing and you're right. This is very Similar to that I'm gonna, I have an idea about this. But it's very similar to that and said, you're flexing that muscle because most people think if they're just thinking, they think to themselves, I don't know anybody, but taking the action of writing it down, you will come up with 1020 100, whatever.
Chris Winfield 30:18
And here's, here's how we make it even stronger for you. All right, so we have one column, you write those 20 people down, I go to the next gen,
Jen Gottlieb 30:25
so the next column over, you're going to rank each person on a scale of one to 10. You're going to give them a score, it's going to be on their influence, but not like how many Instagram followers they have, how influential they are, how influential are they in getting you what you want scale of one to 10? Okay, so
James Altucher 30:43
so guess All right, like, yes,
Jen Gottlieb 30:45
it's a guess. Like, if you could rank them like, so if James, if you were on my list, and I wanted to get on your show, I would say
James Altucher 30:52
one because you're on your attack, right?
Jen Gottlieb 30:56
Is the highest one is the lowest Exactly. But even before I got on your show, I would say James is 10. He's my friend, like, yeah, there we go. So then, so you're gonna write, so maybe it's someone that it's one of those people that you're like, oh, man, I haven't spoken to them in years, I don't even think they liked me. But they're on the list, that's fine. Maybe they're one or two, like have they have a low score, that's okay, they can be on the list, they just have a lower score. Okay. So then we move over to the next column, and the next column on the top, you're going to write the word help. And you're going to rank that person on a scale of one to 10. Same person, we're just going across the column there, on how likely they are to help you get you what you want. So in this case, it's the media. So let's use James, let's use this example again. So let's say I really want to get on the James Altucher show well influence James's show, he's a 10. Help, I would say James and I are pretty good friends, I think that he would put me on the show. So I would say like a 10, maybe a nine if I was feeling a little insecure, but like a high score. But let's say this is someone on your list that maybe you barely spoken to them, you don't have a great relationship, you haven't done a lot to help them, you know, it would be one of those situations where they would be annoyed if you ask them, they will be one or two or three, right? So we've got those scores, then you're going to add up the two scores, the influence and the help score. And you're going to get a grand final score for each person in the final column. And you're going to sort the scores in descending order. That means the people with the highest scores are at the top, the people with the lowest scores are at the bottom, okay? Okay, now, here's what's gonna happen next. For all you introverts Don't worry, the people at the top of the list their 20s 1980s, they've got high scores, they're influential, they can get you what you want, and they are likely to help you because you have a good relationship with them. So for those people, you're going to pull up your pants and you're just going to ask them, you're going to ask them for help, you're going to say, James, hi, I really want to be on your show, like I've always wanted to, it would make my whole life like I could provide a lot of value for your audience. I could talk about how to get on TV in five days, you know, do you think we could schedule you know, maybe on podcast good.
Chris Winfield 32:56
Another good thing to do around that, like when you're making that ask is like, say like, you can also be like, Listen, I'm really scared to ask you this. But I you know, being honest, like I think that that's like going back to humility is another big thing, like but one of my big one of my goals this year is making more uncomfortable ads. And other one of my other goals is being on more influential podcasts like yours. So I have this great idea, but and then you would list it out. So like just saying, like, just like that. It allows you to be you know, more real. And you know, like, if you're friends with somebody and you get something like that you're like, Okay, you can identify with that. Like, yeah, I would feel the same way I get scared to ask people. It's cool that she has this goal. And yeah, this sounds like a great idea. So that it's like something you can just almost come right out and just ask it. So but what about the lower people?
Jen Gottlieb 33:49
Yeah, okay, so And worst case scenario, they say no, but either way you flex your asking muscles. You did something uncomfortable, James I always still now to this day, do Dara the days all the time. All right.
James Altucher 33:58
Writing scary. person off the coffee.
Jen Gottlieb 34:01
Exactly. Exactly. I do that all the time. So that would be my Dara the day to ask somebody from my list. If I could get in the media or or for Michael, a question about what my goal is. Alright. So people are lower on the list. These are the people that you haven't helped in a long time. You don't know them that well, they're not that influential, okay. Instead of asking them for help, you can't do that yet. You have not put in the relationship capital yet to ask these people for help. So when you get to their name on the list, instead of asking them for something, you are going to do one thing to provide value to that person. But here's the thing. You cannot ask them what they need help with. Because that's a homework assignment. We, we don't like Oh, my God,
James Altucher 34:37
I can't believe you said that. I always say don't write me. Don't write anybody and say, Oh, I I love everything you do. I'll help you with whatever you need. What do you need? Yeah, because it's like you said, look, they have attentions, and they're good people, but you can't give someone a homework assignment. They're already busy. That's why you're interested in talking to them because they're busy people, so you can't give them Another thing to do, yeah, I don't know what I need help with.
Jen Gottlieb 35:04
I have no idea. Let me get back to you when I know. And then I never get back. I'm like this is I can't, I can't.
Chris Winfield 35:11
Yeah, it's something that you get a homework assignment. You don't want to do that. Yeah.
Jen Gottlieb 35:17
So your job is to figure out what that person needs to do it.
James Altucher 35:23
I feel like you took my life from this several year period where I did this. And you've, you've turned it into a process and a methodology, like this is how I realized I needed to do things is to provide enormous enormous value in order to get even, like, one response. And it but it works. That works. So so but like, what's what's a, give me an example of like, cuz you guys work with a lot of people? What's an example of maybe even a hard case where they went through this? And they, they figured out how to help somebody? And then one thing led to another?
Chris Winfield 35:57
Yeah. So give me a great example. So yeah, I remember at one of our events, this that, you know, we bring together producers and all these different people, there's a producer from Good Morning America there. And this woman was talking to him. attendee at our event. And she's talking to him, and he like just having a regular conversation, because that's all we say, like, you know, have like real conversations with people, like get to know them. Again, in a, in a case, like where it's like a mixer, like that type of thing. Don't talk about like, you know, just like, Oh my God, what do you need help with? What are you working on? What are you doing this? And as part of the conversation, it came up, he's like, You know what, like, I'm so stressed right now, I need to find this guest for the end of the week. I need to find a parent with a kid that's graduating college that has in you know, that doesn't have a job yet. She's like, you met years looking at him, like she literally her son was getting ready to graduate. And, and she wound up being on Good Morning America. And it was a segment with her. Her son, Barbara Corcoran, Robert Mercer, you know, and then she then you know, through like really going the extra mile she was able to then connect with Barbara and Robert after do a Facebook Live with them, like on their channels. And just as a matter of just like listening and being there. You know, we've had people who've gone through our BNPB boot camp, who like just from, remember this one guy, he had spent about 60 grand with a PR agency the year before. And they had told him, they booked zero, they booked zero segments for him. And they told him, You're the reason why you're gonna have to change. And like they didn't take any accountability, any ownership, they blamed it on him saying that he you know, just like the way he was, he's a life coach. Absolutely amazing life coach, great guy. And, you know, when he went through our boot camp, and the five day boot camp that you're talking about before it, he wasn't like, our thing is like, we're like, be more you like, lean into who you are, unless you're going to change like for me, like, I'm not going to get my doctor and I'm not going to do anything. So I lean into not having those degrees, I lean into all that stuff. But for him, and he literally took exactly what we you know, taught him and by the weekend, and this was during the the protests around George Floyd and everything. He wound up figuring out a way and building relationships and got on CNN that weekend. And then was so good, because what we teach people as well as like, treat the reporter, the producer, the writer, the editor, like they're your best friend, that's how I always did everything. That's how I kept getting booked over and over just I would make it so easy for them make their job so easy. Because if you make their job easy, they're gonna remember you because especially now, they're so short staffed, and there's a 24/7 365 day news cycle, it never stops. So if you make their job easy, they're gonna want you back. So this guy got brought back, they even had one time where they gave him his own hashtag on CNN, America's life coach is on hashtag like, how great of that branding. You know, this guy, as a result went from zero TV appearances to I think he did over 200 and, you know, the last year and just like a little celebrity
Jen Gottlieb 39:27
now.
James Altucher 39:29
He started out on this be on TV the bootcamp? Yeah, exactly. What's the what's the bootcamp?
Chris Winfield 39:35
Alright, we know that it's perfect for your audience. Genuine break down what it is, and then I want to also just like, say what we're gonna do for surprise.
James Altucher 39:46
So I'm happy you're gonna do something for
Jen Gottlieb 39:50
this isn't? Well, first, this is our favorite show that there is okay. We've been listening to it since beginning of time. So whatever we can do for your listeners, but the beyond TV bootcamp is we teach anybody that has a service a story or a product or something that they want to get recognized for get on TV for we'll teach you how to get on TV, leverage TV, be better on camera in five days or less. So in five days, essentially, a lot of our people end up using what Chris just said, using the stuff that we teach them in the beginning of the boot camp and get on TV before the bootcamp even ends. And many of the people that come to our boot camp, actually have never been on camera before are very introverted, are very shy, or very scared. And they've never even done a Facebook Live. And what we do in this boot camp is we don't only teach people how to pitch how to get their messaging, right, how to find the lien in story, how to do the top 20 how to leverage their relationships. But most importantly, we really help them with a combination of the community of the amazing people that we bring together. And also the mindset shift that we help them create in the beginning to be able to really get those limiting beliefs out the door and start to actually oh my gosh, press go live or record and get on camera for the very first time. And many of the people that come to us that have never done that before in their life. They were on camera for the first time during the beyond TV bootcamp. And now some of them have their own TV shows, they've written books, they're on Facebook, every day they've been on TV, it's just we lift the veil of that scariness of, of what it might feel like to be on TV, and help them push through that and get more confident.
Chris Winfield 41:24
It's all done virtually. So it's not a in person thing. It's, you know, we teach it in about an hour a day over five days, you know, through Facebook, live and or zoom. And, you know, so it's really, really easy and convenient for people. Sweatpants. Yeah, and I just want to give out because we're gonna do something special just for your people. So if they go to be on TV bootcamp.com. So be on TV boot camp, exactly. Like it sounds / altucher, then there's going to be something special there waiting for them.
James Altucher 41:59
Oh, that's great. Thank you so much. And and you know, I think it's I forgot to ask, but you mentioned this, it's very important. Once you're on TV, like I remember the very first time I was on a television show in 2004, I was so nervous, I thought I was going to get sick, I was just going to walk out at the last minute and just say, forget it, I'm not going to do this. But you know, now it's much easier for me. But having that on camera presence is really important. Like now, you know that I've done so much public speaking and even comedy and stuff like that I feel much more comfortable. But what are tips you give for people who are like, first time on TV or Facebook Live or whatever.
Jen Gottlieb 42:40
So one of the things that we teach, I'm going to give your listeners a little sneak peek, because this is my favorite thing. And that has actually completely changed my life when it comes to imposter syndrome. So many people get this, I need this right now. Yeah, James, this is gonna blow your mind, you're gonna love it, you're gonna use it. So this thing called imposter syndrome, right? Where we feel like, Oh, who am I to do this? Who am I to be speaking on the stage or my to be on television, or who am I to talk about this one day, they're all gonna figure out that I'm a fraud, or I don't really know anything I get these limiting beliefs on on the daily basis. And a lot of other things. I used to be on page one for 14 seasons, and I interviewed rock stars. And every single one of these rockstars. They were like it was like slash and like all the guys that the biggest rock stars of all time. They all had imposter syndrome too. And I was like, Whoa, if you guys feel like imposters and you're nervous, then I guess I'm kind of normal. I guess all humans experienced this. But the reason that we experienced it is because we spend way too much time comparing our wins and our moments to other people's. And we think that other people are doing so much better than us because we're not taking account for all the great things that we've done. Because they're too close to us. It's like boring, like, all the things that I've done is it's not that interesting to me. But if I were to tell somebody else, maybe they would think it's pretty badass. So I created this thing called the badass lash, which we actually do on the first day of the bootcamp. And it has helped so many people to not only we had one woman that was on the suicide hotline, the day before our boot camp, and she was gonna kill herself. And she signed up for our boot camp, and she came on and we did the badass list with her. She created her badass list. And then she was like, I have something to live for. And she continued on and this woman is thriving. Alright, well,
James Altucher 44:23
how do I make you mad? Okay, so
Jen Gottlieb 44:25
this is that. Yeah, I've talked it up a lot. Here we go. So you're going to make a list in your phone. So not on a piece of paper. I want it to be in your notes in your phone. So you always have it of all the moments in your life when you were a total badass. And these could be personal moments like when your daughter was born. What you know, when you spoke in front of 1000s of people, maybe someone ran a marathon maybe when you want a huge chess tournament. When your podcast went live when you hit a certain amount of listeners moments in your life where you took a beat and you were like, wow, I'm pretty cool. That was pretty awesome. And you feel that and I want you to
James Altucher 44:59
know that there and Sorry, sorry, it was interesting there is my first instinct is to say, oh, it's never happened. But then you start listing things. And of course, yeah, you listed things, particularly to me. But you're right, there are these moments that you it's almost like you have to give a little for, for people who like for someone who was just on the suicide hotline, they might not see that there were any moments, but they need to be just reminded. So it's good to do the reminder.
Jen Gottlieb 45:24
Exactly. And here's where it really gets crazy, because it feels very different. Now, when you feel like an imposter, and you're having that moment where you're like, who am I to be on TV, or James, before you went on that segment for the first time, and you were so nervous, you would take out your badass list, and you would read it out loud, but you read it as if you're reading about somebody else, maybe someone, maybe someone you're proud of, or someone you're jealous of, and pretend it's another person and you read those things. And just ask yourself, like, Is this person a badass? Like, am I impressed with this person, and you're in, take a moment, to marvel at yourself, and be kind of jealous of yourself or be like, Whoa, this person's really cool. And then take a beat, take a breath and be like, holy crap, that person's me. And if I could do all those things, what I'm about to do is like, absolutely no big deal. I'm totally worthy of doing less.
James Altucher 46:13
And do you feel when people go through that process and that exercise when they then if there's a before and after? Like, do you see a difference? I mean, I'm sure that Oh, my
Chris Winfield 46:22
God, massive, the woman that Jen's talking about just for an exam base, this woman named Brendan, she's come out publicly talked about this, but she had been in the army, and she had been sexually assaulted in the army many years ago, she was a black woman. And this was right during the time around, like everything that had happened with George Floyd and all that. And her marriage had just broken down. So all these things, you know, kind of combined, and she literally was was about to she said, take myself out. Because she just felt like she had nothing to live for anymore. And she called the suicide hotline, and the guy, you know, talk to her and said, Listen, just hang on for one day and find something to do, you know, find something that interests you. And she wound up getting an email and the email talked about our BNPB boot camp. And it was from somebody she trusted, and she was like, you know, I don't really want to be on TV. But this is something that I can do at least. And she said she came on and like that first day. And she was like, you know, like, Who are these two people, I hate them, you know, this, like, they're so happy and shining like, this is not gonna work. And literally, she when she did the badass list that Jen talked about, and she said, she like, she started reading it. And she just started sobbing, and remembered all of the things you know, the all the amazing things she had done in her life and all these different things. And like, literally, it was like almost like an instant transformation. She just like went into motion. And she started then she started creating, she did like a Facebook Live talking about this. And then here's where it becomes more powerful, though, is the biggest success ripples, ripples. She then I think the next day, she gets a message from a woman whose son had committed suicide four years before. And this woman had been in deep mourning for bait for four years, like to the point where she really wasn't feeding her kids, like, you know, just like she wasn't really getting out of bed. She said, thanks to you for this morning. For the first time in four years, I woke up, I went downstairs, I cooked my kids breakfast for the first time because you shared your story. And you know, that's like the thing that we're really like the most passionate about, you know, a lot of people listening or might be thinking like, I don't necessarily want to be on TV. And there's a lot of people that come that Don't you know that they but we are able to help them improve their confidence.
James Altucher 48:46
We're not just about TV, this, this is really the power of ask, like, how to ask and TV is just an example. It's like a hard thing to ask for.
Chris Winfield 48:54
Exactly what we always say is we're a media company that is secretly a personal development company. We just use media as the gateway to that. And you know, what happens is people want you know, they get more connected, because there's like the people as you talked about the beginning, coming to our events or seeing how like, we bring together good people and we show them the power of gratitude, we show them the power of connection of you know, of helping somebody else to feel better, because that's how you always do. And you know, it just becomes this ripple effect. And it's so unbelievably powerful. When's,
James Altucher 49:27
when's your next bootcamp? When's, when is it?
Chris Winfield 49:29
So the next one's coming up really, really soon? So you go to beontvbootcamp.com/altucher, and you can sign up. I think it's in like the next week and beontvbootcamp.com/altucher
James Altucher 49:45
and let me let me ask you a question. That's two questions I have. One is I've heard you guys both talk a lot about unfair advantage. In fact, I've stolen the phrase from you and I've also talked a lot about unfair advantage. So I I really think this is a very strong concept, which I always bring to Pete, I tell talk to people about this all the time. Like if someone says, Oh, I think XYZ stock is a buy, or I think this might be a good business, I was asking, like, why you? Like, why would you have any edge over the other 7 billion people on this planet on what you're doing here? Or you know, you want to write a book on this? People have already read a book on it. Like why what's what do you have to offer, and I don't say it in a mean way. But the concept of an unfair advantage, even if it's tiny, is so important. And it's related to this because everybody's unique, as you said, even when when they make their list of influencers and their badass list and the list of people who can help them all that is a unique combination, and to some extent, is part of their unfair advantage, plus the ways in which they could help others. So define what you mean by unfair advantage.
Chris Winfield 50:52
So for us where this came from, was, I was in this stolen in a small mastermind with three other guys when they all lived in New York City. I know. Yeah, you definitely did. Todd Herman. Well, yeah, on your show, Jonathan fields, who was one of the top podcasts my
James Altucher 51:11
you know, you know, Jonathan, I are second cousins. So I didn't know that. Yeah. Sorry. We couldn't we it's somewhere on the family tree. I forget exactly. The the Matt's cool.
Chris Winfield 51:21
Yeah, you both have huge podcasts and have lived like, almost like, away from each other when you were in New York City. So and then Ryan Lee, who runs a amazing sports bar company. So anyway, they, you know, one of the big greatest advantages of being around people that are smart and can see thing, they can see things that you can't necessarily see. So one day, I came to me that we would meet like, every month, and the at that point, I had, like a personal development and productivity company, because that's what I was really passionate about the time, even though I wasn't that passionate, but that's what I was just into, and I was like, Alright, I'm gonna sell stuff around this, and, and they looked at me, and they're like, Chris, why are you not teaching people what you know, best? And I was like, Well, what do you mean, you know, I didn't necessarily like hearing that. But they're like, Well, anytime we describe you to anyone, we describe you as our unfair advantage. And I was like, What do you mean by that, like, well, if we want to get in the media, we want to find an agent, we want to find a freelance, like, we need anything, you're able to take out your phone, text somebody and make it happen in 30 seconds, where it would, you know, take us like weeks. And I thought about it. And the unfair advantage had was just my network, my relationships, that connections that I had built. And, and by the way, the reason I say day, I don't remember which one, and they all take credit for it now, because it became something. It wasn't i They all say, Oh, I'm the one who said it, but I just make it into that they all had the idea. And you know, so I started to really think about that. And then I started to really think about it with the media. And there was so there are so many entrepreneurs, especially that I would meet that would just think of the media as like some black box where you know, I don't know how like, they're like, I don't get the language, I don't know how to get inside it. I don't know how to get behind the rope, whatever it is. And I started doing these events to just show people like how easy it is, it's based on relationships, it's based on just having something unique about your story. It's based on showing up for people like that really works. And it's also it works for like, if you're a good person, it doesn't meet like, you know, there's a lot of bad stuff in that happens in the media. And then people have all these different, you know, conceptions about it, but like are, we're just looking to get good stuff into the media, we're looking at good people with good stories that are doing good. And the thing that we always say to people is that you have a responsibility. So you ever like in this, this makes it so much easier for them to understand, like your responsibility to get your story in front of people to get your product or service in front of people. Because if you don't, somebody else is going to buy it from somebody who doesn't care as much as you do. Who's not as good as you and who's not going to be able to get them the results that you can just because you think that self promotion is gross. You know, like that whole thing. So that's like where the whole idea around unfair advantage for us came from was just like thinking about unfair advantage being our relationships and our unique story. The other thing that we always say is your message, your message, and you know that you are somebody that is so great with this is sharing the messy parts of your life. You're somebody as you know, and I've told you this multiple times, has inspired me your book literally changed my life. And side note, the way I found you if it wasn't for media, I would never have found you because I found you from a random TechCrunch article. I don't even know how many years it's seven or eight years ago you wrote like 100 things of something. And I was like who is this? guy this is amazing. Like I'd save the article, I went and and this is how media works. This is exactly how it works. It's not direct, like you wouldn't know this unless I told you, but I meant I Googled you, I found choose yourself. I read choose yourself. It was a book literally changed my life. I don't say I've told you this privately. But and then I just started reading every single thing by you. And it led me to another book that wound up changing my life, which was the science of getting rich. You mentioned that randomly and yeah, and you were the first one to turn me on that and like, but like, think about that? How cool is that? Like, that's from I saw you in the media. You know, then I saw other stuff about you in the media, I just And then like, I became like, I'm gonna read everything this guy ever wrote. And I literally did. And you know, that's the that's and then the thing around your message, your message like for each person, like the a lot of people think they have to be perfect, and they can't share like their backstory or anything like this. No way we want you know, like, people don't want perfect anymore. I don't know if they ever did.
James Altucher 56:05
Yeah, you know, and it'll, it'll create controversy sometimes. And some people won't like it that you're sharing that. But those people you don't want to deal with anyway.
Chris Winfield 56:13
Exactly. And that's great. Because you don't you want to you want to push away the people that aren't for you just as much as you want to bring the people in that are. And people
Jen Gottlieb 56:22
always ask us, like, how do you stand out from the crowd, because a lot of the people that come to our be on TV bootcamp or come to our event, they're like, oh, my gosh, there's hundreds, not 1000s of other life coaches, or people that do the exact same thing as me or authors that have written this exact same book. And what we say, like, honestly, your unfair advantage is you. There is only one you there was only one James Altucher. There's only one Chris Winfield, there's only one Gen. And someone can say the exact same thing that you're saying. But there's going to be people out there that only resonate with the way that you say it. And that is your unfair advantage. And if you stay true to who you are, whether that is imperfect, the more imperfect, the better, right? The more imperfect, the more messy, the more just authentically you you can be, the more people are going to really resonate with you or really be like you said, James, like, appalled by you. And that's even better, because that's how you attract raving fans.
James Altucher 57:13
No, I agree. Like you have to be, you can't be like, like, first of all, there's no such thing as the crowd, like everybody just buys into a language. So they feel like, oh, it's acceptable if I speak in this language, and everybody's unique, like you say, and as long as you don't write in that common language, you're where you're afraid to expose everything and you only say the acceptable things. You'll never have the unfair advantage you have to you have to be authentic, you have to speak like you you have to write like you you have to be comfortable in whatever situation you're in, like, even if you're on TV, it's just a conversation with someone doesn't matter that the cameras are there. And I think that's right, that is a strong like, for me, I built a I had an audience already from writing. But once I started really being you know, this is like 2009 2010 really exposing like, everything going on horrible in my life, though my audience went up, that was my unfair advantage. My audience went up huge. Nobody was doing it at that time. And so So here's another question. This is this is related to everything we've been talking about. But I'm asking you guys this because I know you'll have an answer for me. I've ghosted a lot of people, particularly over the past year, this is unrelated to be on TV bootcamp calm. But it's but it's related to like when you make the list of who could help me, I feel like I was a little burnt out this year, there was probably a several month period where I just did not respond to anybody like friends, family, whoever. And how do I, what's your advice? How do I like even really, really good friends and I feel really bad. Like, in the beginning of it, I said, Look, I might not respond for a while. But then I just stopped responding to everybody, like really important, successful people that I admired would write to me, and I just never would respond. I tell myself, I have to respond, and I never would. So what should I do to get back in touch with people,
Jen Gottlieb 59:06
I'm always a huge proponent, especially if it's people that you you've had a good relationship with in the past that is a good friend of yours. We all do this, right? And I always like my number one tip for when you're networking or you're making a relationship with somebody or you feel awkward is to announce the elephant in the room. Once you've announced the elephant in the room, everybody can exhale, because everybody's been in a similar situation. And never underestimate the other person's insecurities or the other person's fears. presented me no or or they've done the same thing to other people. So I always like to just be completely and totally vulnerable and honest. Because when you're vulnerable and honest, and you just say it and you announce the elephant, it takes all the pressure off and like what's the worst that could happen? So if I were you, I would call my friends text my friends, email, my friends, however you communicate with them and be like, Listen, tell them exactly what you just told us. I don't know what happened. I just I literally didn't talk to anybody. I didn't communicate with anyone. So I want you to know You're important to me. And you know, if you don't want to talk to me ever again, I totally understand.
James Altucher 1:00:05
I like that last part to that even if you don't it's like the it's like the initial I way I send ideas. You don't have to respond to me. Yep. I just want you to know that you're important to me. You know, so whatever, then and then conclude.
Jen Gottlieb 1:00:17
Yeah, and then the biggest thing after that is the one thing that I hate is if someone does that, to me, I'm like, that's amazing. That's cool. I do that too. No worries. I still love you most of the time. You know, I, if someone said that, to me, honestly, I'm, I'm sitting here thinking, I would be like, Wow, thank you for saying that. That takes balls to say that, and to reach out after that, and I really appreciate you. But here's the thing, after you've said that, you can't disappear again. You got to keep you got to stay. And you got you. Yeah, so do you want to do it or not? That's right, we'll say well, you
Chris Winfield 1:00:49
can also say that, like, you know, like, Amazon, there's ebbs and flows in my life. And, you know, the other thing is, like, just by responding, that a lot of times people and I'm definitely guilty of this, we'll make up a story about the relationship. And you know, like thinking it's something that they did, or like, this has happened with me, like with a bunch of people that I've reached out to recently, and I'm like, I'm leaving writing, like, Did I do something wrong, like, and so like, they'll think that maybe you're like, are, you're mad at them, or you're too cool for them, or you're too successful, or whatever it is, like it's like the until like, by just responding. And just like putting it out there like that. We'll just change that part. Because that's often what we do. We like as humans, please me, like, I always will think, oh, it's something this person doesn't like me, because it's something that I did. I remember, I this I tell this story at one of our events, but I had this great relationship with this producer. And I was texting her all the time. And you know, we're doing stuff together. And I texted her one day, and I was I saw that she got a new job at a time. And I was like, congrats on your new gig. And text went through. And I was like, next day, it was like, I just want to make sure you saw that I'm so happy for you. No response. And so in my mind, I'm like, Oh, my God, I hate her now like, she's like, too big good for me like, well, what is time I read it from time to bow of all this. And you know, I went to Jen and Angelo runs our agency. And I was like, Oh, my, I don't think Kate likes me anymore. And bah, bah, bah, and like, let's not do anything with her. And then they're like, why don't you just reach out to her on Facebook? Like, maybe she got a new phone when she changed jobs? And I was like, oh, yeah, that could be it. So I reached out to her on Facebook. She responds to me immediately. She's like, Oh, thank you so much. I'm like, oh, you know, I texted you. She's like, Oh, yeah, I switched phones, I don't have access to that phone anymore. I'm like, oh, yeah, that makes complete sense. And like, my, like, the emojis I was using went from like, passive aggressive to like, happy to, like so excited, you know, over the, the course of that one little tax interaction, and like this, one mentor of mine told me once your mind's a dangerous neighborhood, don't go there alone. So that's why I always go to something, just ask for something.
James Altucher 1:03:10
That's a great quote, I'm gonna steal that one too, and not get that this great, I'm going to experiment with this. I'm going to pick one person today, I'm going to send this email it's exactly the emails you're waiting at Jen and, and see, see how it works. And then one other one other thing, I have an idea for you guys, you know, how you have those four lists? Or? And then five, five lists? Actually, if you have the, the badass list as well, you should this just an idea? Not you should. But what if everybody, if they were comfortable with this? What if everybody did this and made it public on some system you have, and then it's searchable. So for instance, if I and there's also a list of like hashtags, like who I am, like, oh, hashtag nail salon, hashtag software, whatever. And so then I can say, I can search it. Like, let's say it's in one system, almost like a mini social network, like the, the, you know, unfair advantage social network, and I can search it so that oh, do I know anybody who knows someone at Salon weekly, and is also a software person, and blah, blah, and then I'd see all these names, you know, pop up, and I'd see the connection, the interconnections of how I can get from this person to that person. I don't know. Just something. Yeah, kind of like, a probably love it. Because then yeah, and then and then for people who go to the Beyond TV bootcamp, they get access to this kind of very private exclusive network. So like, oh, so and so knows. You know, I don't know some podcaster. It's on their list. And I have an idea for that podcast, but I don't know anybody who knows them. Now. It's all you're all interconnected. Or I need someone who's who's at some point. Given a TED talk, and that's on their badass list, I just want to ask for advice. Before I pitch them, boom, I on someone's badass list or three people on it who've been to one of your boot camps in the past five years. They've been given TED Talks. And so now I could ask them who to pitch. I love it.
Jen Gottlieb 1:05:20
All right. Awesome. Where that builds software. James, I know, you know, some people, you might be on my top 20 list. Yeah. Well,
James Altucher 1:05:27
we'll talk we'll talk so. Okay, so you're doing the beontvbootcamp.com And for listeners slash altucher, I don't know what you'll find there. But it's gonna be good. If I know, Jen and Chris. And it sounds really exciting. So good luck with it. And I again, I think your message is, is super important. Because I know I'm the worst introvert. I'm I was terrified every time I had to give a public talk or go on TV, or whatever I've had. I've had imposter syndrome every day up until this morning. And but this stuff's really important. This has this type of thinking has made my career like more important than anything else. It means I can call people and they and they respond because of all these things that you that you guys have been talking about. So it's, it's really important, whether you're an entrepreneur, or just need help asking for things. This is this is important stuff. So thanks for I've known you guys forever. It's the first time you're on on the podcast. Thanks so much for coming on. You're always welcome back anytime you're a friend of the podcast, and fop. So
Chris Winfield 1:06:36
thank you so much. Thank you. It's so much fun and so grateful for you. Yeah, thank you guys.